Final
STAFF SUMMARY OF MEETING

SENATE COMMITTEE ON STATE, VETERANS, & MILITARY AFFAIRS

Date:03/04/2013
ATTENDANCE
Time:10:39 AM to 09:30 PM
Crowder
X
Harvey
X
Place:SCR 356
Hudak
*
Jones
X
This Meeting was called to order by
Giron
X
Senator Giron
This Report was prepared by
Julia Jackson
X = Present, E = Excused, A = Absent, * = Present after roll call
Bills Addressed: Action Taken:
HB13-1229
HB13-1228
HB13-1226		Amended, Referred to Appropriations
Referred to Appropriations
Referred to the Committee of the Whole


10:39 AM -- House Bill 13-1229

Senator Giron discussed procedures for the day's hearings.


10:43 AM

Senator Carroll, sponsor, presented House Bill 13-1229 to the committee. The bill would expand the situations in which background checks are required prior to the transfer of a firearm and change the process for reporting and updating the records on which background checks are based. Senator Carroll told the committee about the Century 16 theater shooting in Aurora, which occurred in her district. She provided history about the use of background checks on gun sales in Colorado. She discussed the benefits of background checks as a filter to keep guns out of the hands of dangerous individuals.

10:50 AM -- Mr. Ron Sloan, director of the Colorado Bureau of Investigation (CBI), testified in support of the bill. He explained that CBI runs the InstaCheck system used to conduct background checks for gun sales, and he discussed statistics for these background checks. He described the InstaCheck process and explained that the process proposed in HB 13-1229 would be achieved through federally licensed firearms dealers working with the CBI.
















10:58 AM

Senator Crowder, Senator Harvey, and Mr. Sloan discussed denials of firearms transfers based on background checks. Senator Harvey and Mr. Sloan discussed the definition of a transfer under HB 13-1229.

11:06 AM -- Mr. Mark Kelly, representing Americans for Responsible Solutions, testified in support of the bill. He introduced himself to the committee and noted the effects of gun violence on his wife, former Representative Gabrielle Giffords. He discussed this shooting in Tucson, noting the common heritage between Colorado and Arizona. Mr. Kelly stated that he and his wife own guns and discussed the importance of gun rights in America. He continued that these rights do not extend to criminals or the mentally ill. He discussed the support for background checks in America.


11:15 AM

Senator Crowder and Mr. Kelly discussed the role of mental illness in shooting deaths. Senator Carroll noted that HB 13-1229 moves the InstaCheck process toward including mental health information in real time. Senator Harvey and Mr. Kelly discussed the specifics of gun transfers under the bill.

11:20 AM -- Senator Carroll showed the committee a video from Aurora Police Chief Dan Oates, testifying in support of the bill. He noted that he represents the city of Aurora and the Colorado Association of Chiefs of Police in his testimony. He noted that Aurora police officers frequently recover guns from convicted felons, and he discussed the importance of imposing background checks on private sales.

11:24 AM -- Mr. David Chipman, representing himself and Mayors Against Illegal Guns, testified in support of the bill. He described his experience as a special agent with the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms, and Explosives (BATFE), from which he is retired. He stated that background checks work and discussed their benefits for public safety. Mr. Chipman explained that expanding background checks will help crack down on gun trafficking. Senator Harvey and Mr. Chipman discussed background check systems in place in other states.

11:31 AM -- Ms. Jane Dougherty, representing herself and her family, testified in support of the bill. She explained that her sister, Mary Sherlock, was killed at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Connecticut. She described the aftermath of this tragedy and her own response.

11:36 AM -- Pastor Del Phillips, representing The House Worship Center, testified in support of the bill. He told the committee about his church and described his role in the Denver faith community. He discussed the benefits of expanding background checks to private sales.

11:40 AM -- Ms. Karina Sartidine Vargas, representing herself, testified in support of the bill. She described her experience when she was injured in a gun crime at age 16.















11:44 AM -- Mr. Dave Hoover and Ms. Theresa Hoover, representing themselves, testified in support of the bill. Mr. Hoover explained that his nephew, AJ Boik, was killed in the Aurora theater shooting. He discussed his experience as a police officer and the importance of implementing reasonable gun laws. He told the committee about his nephew, and about his own experience on the night of the theater shooting. Ms. Hoover added her experience as AJ's mother and stated that the bill would make a difference.

11:50 AM -- Mr. David Moses, representing himself, testified in support of the bill. He described his experience when his brother died in a gun homicide 26 years ago. He stated that his brother's murderer would not have passed a background check.

11:54 AM -- Ms. Katie Lyles, representing herself, testified in support of the bill. She explained that she was a student at Columbine High School when the 1999 shooting occurred, and that she is currently a teacher. She described the lock-down drills she conducts with her second grade students and discussed the benefits of increasing background checks.

11:57 AM -- Ms. Marjorie Sloan, Mayor of Golden, testified in support of the bill. She stated that she represents Mayors Against Illegal Guns as well as the Golden City Council. She discussed the problems with the existing private sale loophole to background checks.

12:01 PM -- Mr. Tom Mauser, representing himself, testified in support of the bill. He explained that his son Danny was killed at Columbine High School, and he noted that the shooters at Columbine got their guns through a gun show, where background checks were not required at the time. He discussed the history of background checks in Colorado. He added that other states are watching Colorado's work on this issue.

12:04 PM -- Mr. Ted Pascoe, representing Colorado Ceasefire, testified in support of the bill. He described his organization's work and discussed current law and the benefits to the bill. He stated that the bill would level the playing field for licensed firearms dealers, and he noted that background checks have been found to be reasonable and constitutional.

12:07 PM -- Mr. Donald Macalady, representing Hunters Against Gun Violence, testified in support of the bill. He described his organization's work and stated that many hunters support reasonable gun safety laws. He stated that expanded background checks will move society toward a reduction in gun crimes, which benefits gun owners. He requested that additional legislation not increase the burden on taxpayers in the state. Senator Crowder and Mr. Macalady discussed the burdens imposed by background checks.

12:12 PM -- Mr. Alan Franklin, representing Progress Now Colorado, testified in support of the bill. He discussed his organization's support for the bill and noted that polls show wide support for expanding background checks. He stated that opponents have lied about the effects of the bill.

Committee members responded to Mr. Franklin's testimony.

12:18 PM -- Mr. Mark Thrun, representing the Colorado Public Health Association, testified in support of the bill. He explained his organization's work and discussed public health issues of gun violence.











12:20 PM -- Mr. Jack Dais, representing Hunters Against Gun Violence, testified in support of the bill. He argued that the bill's provisions are not burdensome for gun owners. Senator Crowder and Mr. Dais discussed familial exchange of guns and issues related to gun collecting.

12:25 PM -- Ms. Amy Miller, representing the Colorado Coalition Against Domestic Violence, testified in support of the bill. Ms. Miller described an experience of a gun purchased without a background check by a domestic abuser despite current law prohibiting such purchase. She discussed statistics that show greater fatalities in domestic violence cases where guns are available. Senator Harvey discussed this testimony with Ms. Miller.

12:31 PM -- Ms. Krista Ceresa, representing herself and her family, testified in opposition to the bill. She told the committee about her mother, who was killed by gun violence. She argued that if her mother had a gun she could have protected herself and her family. She discussed the impact of the incident on her family. She discussed her right to carry a concealed weapon to protect herself and her family. She argued that the current bill only restricts law abiding citizens and limits their rights to protect themselves or their families.


12:40 PM

Senator Harvey discussed the murder of Krista's mother and its impact on the state. Senator Crowder discussed Ms. Ceresa's testimony.

12:42 PM -- Mr. John Cooke, Weld County Sheriff, testified in opposition to the bill. He explained the position of the Colorado Sheriffs' Association and discussed the unenforceable aspects of the bill. He argued that the bill will not prohibit criminals from obtaining guns. He added that background checks will not be enforceable in interstate gun exchanges and therefore will not prevent gun violence. Sheriff Cooke argued that law enforcement officers have no way of enforcing the bill because there is no way for them to know whether a background check was done.


12:46 PM

Committee members discussed the ability to enforce the bill with Sheriff Cooke. Sheriff Cooke argued that law enforcement agencies in the Denver metro area support of the bill, while many others around the state do not.

12:54 PM -- Mr. Tom Grounder, representing himself as a firearms trainer, testified in opposition to the bill. He argued that the current rise in gun ownership is in response to the threat of gun restrictions. Mr. Grounder argued that the bill takes away liberties by restricting an individual's ability to protect his or her safety.

12:58 PM -- Mr. Doug Hamilton, representing himself as the owner of the Cherry Creek Family Shooting Center, testified in opposition to the bill. He argued that the bill puts greater restrictions on gun sellers. He discussed background checks in relation to shootings at Sandy Hook Elementary and Virginia Tech. He argued that the bill restricts law abiding citizens and does not keep guns out of the hands of criminals.














01:03 PM -- Mr. Gene Pearcey, representing himself and his shooting school, testified in opposition to the bill. He argued that the bill will not affect current criminals and will instead restrict law-abiding citizens. He argued that the current bill will affect the tourism and sportsman trade in Colorado. He argued that the intent of the bill is only more gun control. He argued that guns purchased online must go through the local jurisdictions of the purchaser.

01:10 PM -- Mr. David Kopel, representing himself as a law professor at the University of Denver and research fellow at the Independence Institute, spoke against the bill. He argued that the current bill is unenforceable without gun registration and a government database of firearms. He discussed logistical problems with HB 13-1229 and stated that the bill is based on a national model popular in large east coast cities. He suggested that the sheriffs and other legal experts could improve the bill to address only sales between people who do not know each other. He continued to suggest problems with the bill's use of the word transfer.


01:23 PM

Senator Crowder and Mr. Kopel discussed similar laws in other states.

01:25 PM -- Mr. Adam Thompson, representing Columbine Survivors Against Gun Control, testified in opposition to the bill. Committee members received a packet of letters from Mr. Thompson and other Columbine students (Attachment A). He explained that the bill would prevent him from defending himself or his family. He discussed the delay in getting background check results, and he stated that the bill would not stop mass shootings.

13SenState0304AttachA.pdf13SenState0304AttachA.pdf

01:32 PM -- Mr. Dudley Brown, representing Rocky Mountain Gun Owners, testified in opposition to the bill. He expressed concern that the bill violates individuals' ability to take advantage of their constitutional rights. He explained that the background check system allows the government to know who owns guns. He discussed his organization's website that facilitates private gun transactions, and he stated that those transactions have not resulted in crimes.


01:37 PM

Senator Harvey and Mr. Brown discussed the online marketplace for private gun transfers.

01:41 PM -- Mr. Daniel Carey, representing the National Rifle Association (NRA), testified in opposition to the bill. He gave the committee an NRA packet regarding universal background checks (Attachment B) and a "Summary of Select Firearm Violence Prevention Strategies" (Attachment C).

13SenState0304AttachB.pdf13SenState0304AttachB.pdf 13SenState0304AttachC.pdf13SenState0304AttachC.pdf









01:45 PM -- Mr. Terry Maketa, El Paso County Sheriff, testified in opposition to the bill. He discussed his work as sheriff and noted that the bill would criminalize citizens who are following the law. He suggested that a better option would be holding people accountable when they break the law. He discussed the National Instant Criminal Background Check System (NICS) as it compares to the InstaCheck system. Mr. Maketa added that there is currently an 18 day backlog for background checks in Colorado, and he expressed concern with adding to the burden on this system.


01:58 PM

Senator Crowder and Mr. Maketa discussed the role of the sheriffs in the bill's drafting process. Mr. Maketa added information about criminal prosecution in cases where background checks resulted in denials.


02:02 PM

At the chair's request, those in the room who were unable to testify stood to express their opposition to HB 13-1229. Committee members received written testimony from some of these witnesses (Attachment D).

13SenState0304AttachD.pdf13SenState0304AttachD.pdf

02:07 PM

The committee recessed.


02:13 PM

The committee reconvened. Senator Giron presented Amendment L.028 (Attachment E) to HB 13-1229. She explained that the amendment would require the provision of background check results to additional people, expand the types of family members exempt from the background check requirement, make technical corrections, and clarify the types of temporary transfers that can be conducted without a background check. Committee members and Senator Carroll discussed Amendment L.028.

13SenState0304AttachE.pdf13SenState0304AttachE.pdf















02:24 PM

Committee discussion continued on Amendment L.028.
BILL:HB13-1229
TIME: 02:31:28 PM
MOVED:Giron
MOTION:Adopt amendment L.028. The motion passed on a vote of 3-2.
SECONDED:
VOTE
Crowder
No
Harvey
No
Hudak
Yes
Jones
Yes
Giron
Yes
YES: 3 NO: 2 EXC: 0 ABS: 0 FINAL ACTION: PASS


02:32 PM

Senator Carroll described Amendment L.023 (Attachment F). She explained that the amendment makes technical fixes for the Judicial Department and clarifies the electronic transfer of information to be included in the InstaCheck database. The committee discussed the amendment's length.

13SenState0304AttachF.pdf13SenState0304AttachF.pdf

02:39 PM

The committee recessed.




















02:40 PM

The committee reconvened. Senator Giron and Senator Carroll discussed the technical nature of the amendment. Senator Carroll responded to questions from Senator Marble. The committee discussed the inclusion of non-committee members in the hearing.
BILL:HB13-1229
TIME: 02:47:26 PM
MOVED:Jones
MOTION:Adopt amendment L.023. The motion passed on a vote of 3-2.
SECONDED:
VOTE
Crowder
No
Harvey
No
Hudak
Yes
Jones
Yes
Giron
Yes
YES: 3 NO: 2 EXC: 0 ABS: 0 FINAL ACTION: PASS


02:48 PM

Senator Carroll described Amendment L.026 (Attachment G), which addresses firearms held in trust.

13SenState0304AttachG.pdf13SenState0304AttachG.pdf





















BILL:HB13-1229
TIME: 02:48:49 PM
MOVED:Jones
MOTION:Adopt amendment L.026. The motion passed on a vote of 3-2.
SECONDED:
VOTE
Crowder
No
Harvey
No
Hudak
Yes
Jones
Yes
Giron
Yes
YES: 3 NO: 2 EXC: 0 ABS: 0 FINAL ACTION: PASS


02:49 PM

Senator Jones and Senator Hudak discussed their positions on the bill.


02:53 PM

Senator Carroll addressed points raised in the testimony. She stated that the bill does not interfere with Coloradans' rights to own guns. She discussed the use of background checks in Colorado, and she noted that the bill would still benefit the state even if it does not result in perfect compliance.




























02:59 PM

Senator Harvey and Senator Carroll discussed the role of third-party facilitators of gun sales under the bill. Committee members continued to discuss the bill.
BILL:HB13-1229
TIME: 03:03:58 PM
MOVED:Jones
MOTION:Refer House Bill 13-1229, as amended, to the Committee on Appropriations. The motion passed on a vote of 3-2.
SECONDED:
VOTE
Crowder
No
Harvey
No
Hudak
Yes
Jones
Yes
Giron
Yes
Final YES: 3 NO: 2 EXC: 0 ABS: 0 FINAL ACTION: PASS


03:18 PM -- House Bill 13-1228

Senator Heath, sponsor, presented House Bill 13-1228 to the committee. The bill would require the Colorado Bureau of Investigation (CBI) to charge a fee for performing instant criminal background checks related to the transfer of firearms. Senator Heath explained that at its most basic, the bill is a fee bill. He discussed court precedent for the use of similar fees and provided history regarding Colorado's background check system.

03:23 PM -- Mr. Ron Sloan, Director of the CBI, testified on the bill. He discussed CBI's objectives regarding turnaround on background checks and appeals. He explained that CBI would work to set an appropriate fee to cover the costs of conducting background checks for gun sales, depending on the needed staffing and monitoring. Senator Harvey and Mr. Sloan discussed denials of gun sales based on background checks.

03:30 PM -- Mr. John Head, representing SAFE Colorado, testified in support of the bill. He stated that improving the funding of the background check system would reduce delays and thereby improve the system. Senator Harvey discussed this testimony with Mr. Head.

03:36 PM -- Ms. Annmarie Jensen, representing the Colorado Association of Chiefs of Police, testified in support of the bill. She explained that the chiefs of police believe that background checks improve public safety, and that the bill will provide revenue to keep the system running smoothly.












03:37 PM -- Ms. Jacqui Shumway, representing Colorado Ceasefire, testified in support of the bill. She noted that the money spent by the state on background checks could be better spent on other state programs, and she described other constitutional rights that have costs associated with them.

03:41 PM -- Ms. Jean Grattet, representing the League of Women Voters, testified in support of the bill. She stated that a fee would not interfere with the right to own a firearm and would allow background checks to be conducted in a timely fashion. Senator Crowder discussed this testimony with Ms. Grattet.

03:47 PM -- Ms. Eileen McCarron, representing herself, testified in support of the bill. She noted that as a teacher, she had to pay for her background check to get a license. She discussed the history of funding for gun sale background checks.

03:49 PM -- Mr. Michael McGuire, representing himself and his wife, testified in support of the bill. He discussed the value of background checks and his belief that the bill proposes a reasonable fee. He noted that he and his wife have paid fees for their background checks in the past.

03:54 PM -- Ms. Carole Bell, representing herself, testified in support of the bill. She described her experience after her son was killed in a hunting accident. She noted that individuals pay for many services provided by the government, and she discussed other uses for the money saved.

03:59 PM -- Mr. Jerry Arca, representing himself, testified in support of the bill. He expressed support for all the gun bills currently being debated. He noted that his church, First Congregational in Englewood, has also formally voted to support gun control legislation at the state and national level. He stated that these bills would help slow firearm violence.

04:02 PM -- Ms. Tina Francone, representing herself, testified in opposition to the bill. She stated that she is a firearms instructor, and she explained that the bill discriminates against those who cannot afford to pay the fees. She discussed the problems with placing fees on constitutional rights. Ms. Francone discussed concerns that the fee will rise in the future and become unaffordable. She described an incident of a woman who was trained in self defense who was unable to protect herself without a gun. Senator Marble and Ms. Francone discussed similar fees in other states.

04:21 PM -- Mr. Dave Gill, Vice President of the Colorado State Shooting Association, testified in opposition to the bill. He discussed the cumulative effects of adding fees for background checks, eventually making firearms ownership prohibitively expensive. He expressed concern that the fees would continue to rise.

04:26 PM -- Ms. Kelsey Alexander, representing herself, testified in opposition to the bill. She discussed her experience with violence in her community.

















04:30 PM

Ms. Alexander described her role as owner of the Centennial Gun Club. She noted that background checks are not currently being delayed, so the fee is unnecessary. She further stated that the bill will expand government while making it harder to run her business.

04:38 PM -- Mr. Adam Ochs, representing himself, testified in opposition to the bill. He stated that the bill violates his rights under the Constitution by imposing a fee on those rights. Senator Marble and Mr. Ochs discussed the distinction between rights and privileges.

04:43 PM -- Mr. George Rabtzow, Jr., representing himself, testified in opposition to the bill. He noted that the bill places a fee on a constitutionally protected right.

04:47 PM -- Mr. Dana Keech, representing himself, testified in opposition to the bill. He discussed the large increases in vehicle registration fees in recent years, and he expressed concern that background check fees would go the same way.

04:49 PM -- Mr. David Kopel, law professor and fellow at the Independence Institute representing himself, testified in opposition to the bill. He suggested that the bill be improved by specifying the fee to be charged, noting that similar fees in California now approach $40. He also suggested the bill have a waiver process in place. Senator Crowder discussed this testimony with Mr. Kopel. Senator Giron and Mr. Kopel discussed the fact that the fees were charged from 1994 through 1999.

04:56 PM -- Mr. Doug Fanning, representing himself and his business, TBF Arms, testified in opposition to the bill. He noted that violent crime is at a low right now. He explained the impact of these fees on his business.

05:01 PM -- Mr. Scott Turnball, representing himself and his family, testified in opposition to the bill. He expressed concern with the bill's infringement on his Second Amendment rights, stating that the bill would add roadblocks for gun ownership. He described his personal background with firearms and discussed his need for self-defense. Senator Crowder and Mr. Turnball discussed the bill's impact on rural communities.

05:08 PM -- Mr. Dale Gleason, representing himself and his family, testified in opposition to the bill. He stated that all the gun bills are poorly written, and he expressed concern that HB 13-1228 leaves the actual fees open to adjustment based on CBI's request. He also discussed his opposition to HB 13-1226.

05:14 PM -- Mr. Americus Kalmar, representing himself, testified in opposition to the bill. He discussed his experience living under dictatorships, and he provided examples of safety being improved by allowing more people to carry guns. He added that criminals will not follow background check laws.

05:19 PM -- Ms. Sharon Davis, representing herself, testified in opposition to the bill. She discussed her experience with violence in her neighborhood and expressed her concerns with the bill.













05:21 PM -- Mr. Greg McCrimmon, representing himself, testified in opposition to the bill. He explained that he opposes all the gun bills being heard in the legislature, because the right to bear arms is protected in the US Constitution. He stated that gun control makes society less safe. Senator Crowder discussed this testimony with Mr. McCrimmon.

05:25 PM -- Mr. Alex Vogel, representing himself, testified in opposition to the bill. He stated that gun control bills will not improve safety or reduce crime.

05:32 PM -- Mr. Keith Maines, representing himself and his family, testified in opposition to the bill. He expressed concern that gun control bills infringe upon the constitutional rights of gun owners, and he discussed the history of gun rights.


05:37 PM

Senator Heath summarized his support for the bill and noted that the bill is constitutional. Committee members discussed their positions on the bill.
BILL:HB13-1228
TIME: 05:39:52 PM
MOVED:Jones
MOTION:Refer House Bill 13-1228 to the Committee on Appropriations. The motion passed on a vote of 3-2.
SECONDED:
VOTE
Crowder
No
Harvey
No
Hudak
Yes
Jones
Yes
Giron
Yes
Final YES: 3 NO: 2 EXC: 0 ABS: 0 FINAL ACTION: PASS


05:40 PM -- House Bill 13-1226

The committee recessed.














05:50 PM

The committee returned to order.

Senator Heath, sponsor, presented House Bill 13-1226 to the committee. The bill would add the campuses of public institutions of higher education to the areas where the possession of concealed handguns by concealed carry permit holders is prohibited by law.


05:56 PM

Senator Heath provided statistics about violent crime on college campuses in Colorado. He spoke generally about concealed carry laws and specifically of concealed weapons on college campuses. Conversation ensued between Senator Harvey and Senator Heath about whether it is necessary for students to carry concealed firearms on campus. Senator Harvey stated his belief that no acts of violence have ever been committed on a college campus by a concealed carry permit holder.

06:06 PM -- Ms. Loretta Martinez and Professor Sheila Rucki, representing Metropolitan State University of Denver (MSU), testified in support of the bill. Ms. Martinez discussed weapons bans on the Auraria campus. She indicated that each of the boards of trustees of the higher education institutions on the Auraria campus considered the health, safety, and welfare of the students in each institution. Professor Rucki spoke about the MSU faculty senate's 55-14 vote to extend the ban on concealed firearms. She responded to questions from the committee about the harm caused by the threat of violence and creating a climate of intimidation. Discussion ensued about the potential for the free flow of ideas and the limitation of debate. Senator Harvey provided statistics about acts of violence on the Colorado State University (CSU) campus before and after the concealed carry ban was lifted. The committee discussed whether correlation can prove causality. Ms. Martinez weighed in about complaints her office has received from students about being intimidated by other students with concealed firearms.


06:21 PM

Senator Crowder expressed his opinion that allowing concealed carry on campus enhances safety because anyone who chooses to commit acts of violence does not know whether students and faculty are carrying a concealed firearm. Ms. Martinez and Professor Rucki responded to questions from the committee about the physical makeup of classrooms on the Auraria campus. Professor Rucki distributed the adopted resolution (Attachment H).

13SenState0304AttachH.pdf13SenState0304AttachH.pdf

06:25 PM -- Ms. Sara Heisdorffer, representing herself, testified in support of the bill. Ms. Heisdorfter spoke about her experience as the victim of a sexual assault on the CSU campus by a concealed carry permit holder. She stated that she does not want to carry a weapon, and she should not have to carry a weapon to feel safe on campus.












06:28 PM -- Ms. Shayla Sanders, representing herself, testified in support of the bill. Ms. Sanders expressed her opinion that allowing concealed firearms in the classroom enhances the probability that someone will get shot.

06:30 PM -- Ms. Krystal Lane, representing herself, testified in support of the bill. Ms. Lane stated her opinion that the bill represents a common sense way to ensure public safety. She indicated that knowing other students are carrying firearms does not make her feel safe. She spoke about police officers and their ability to hit a target a majority of the time.

06:34 PM -- Ms. Ali Skewes-Cox, representing herself, testified in support of the bill. Ms. Skewes-Cox discussed the issue of women defending themselves against rape on college campuses. She spoke about suicide rates on college campuses.

06:36 PM -- Ms. Natalie Stein, representing herself, testified in support of the bill. Ms. Stein stated her opinion that her safety is integral to her education at Colorado College. She discussed the culture of residential college campuses and expressed concern about adding guns to this environment. She provided statistics about sexual assaults and incidents of domestic violence. She spoke about misogyny and rape culture and commented that those are the root causes of increased sexual assaults on college campuses.

06:41 PM -- Ms. Toluwanimi Obiwole, representing herself, testified in support of the bill. Ms. Obiwole described her experience attending the University of Colorado-Boulder (CU) and expressed her concerns with allowing guns on campus. Senator Harvey and Ms. Obiwole discussed her experience with the bill. Senator Harvey continued to discuss the bill.

06:51 PM -- Mr. Zach Silverman, representing the CU College Democrats, testified in support of the bill. He discussed the dangers associated with having weapons on campus. He stated that he does not feel threatened on college campuses.

06:57 PM -- Ms. Amy Miller, representing the Colorado Coalition Against Domestic Violence, testified in support of the bill. She described her organization's work. She discussed domestic violence on college campuses and noted that the presence of a gun in these cases increases the risk for intimate partner homicide.

07:00 PM -- Ms. Julie Carr, a professor at CU representing herself and her colleagues, testified in support of the bill. She noted that the faculty of various departments at several University of Colorado campuses have endorsed HB 13-1226. She noted that the perpetrators of many murders have held concealed weapons permits. She discussed substance abuse issues that she has observed among students.

07:09 PM -- Mr. Michael McGuire, representing himself, testified in support of the bill. He discussed his experiences on college campuses and expressed concern for the safety of college students when concealed weapons are allowed.















07:13 PM -- Mr. Ken Bonetti, representing himself, testified in support of the bill. He described his experience as a university employee and discussed employee safety. Mr. Bonetti noted other types of public buildings where concealed weapons are prohibited and noted the benefits of these gun-free zones for their employees. Senator Harvey discussed mass shootings at schools. He and Mr. Bonetti discussed gun-free zones.


07:22 PM

Senator Heath and Senator Harvey continued to discuss the use of gun-free zones.

07:23 PM -- Mr. Terrence May, representing himself and his family, testified in support of the bill. He described his experience living in Boulder and the time he and his family spends at CU. He noted that the existing concealed carry policy would put his daughter at greater risk.

07:30 PM -- Mr. Anthony Cortez, representing himself as a CU student, testified in support of the bill. He explained that the bill would support general safety. Senator Crowder and Senator Heath discussed the training concealed weapons holders undergo.

07:34 PM -- Mr. Evan Todd and Mr. Jared Gates, representing themselves, testified in opposition to the bill. Mr. Todd explained that he survived the Columbine shooting, and he discussed the disadvantages of gun-free zones. He stated that he would have welcomed teachers or anyone else with concealed weapons at Columbine. Mr. Gates explained that he also survived the Columbine shooting and explained that he lost friends on that day. He stated that gun control is ineffective, and he gave examples of this.

07:45 PM -- Ms. Amanda Collins, representing herself, testified in opposition to the bill. She described her experience being raped on a college campus, where concealed carry was prohibited. She discussed options to prevent rapes like this and noted their limitations.


07:55 PM

Senator Harvey and Senator Hudak responded to Ms. Collins' testimony.

07:59 PM -- Mr. Justin Smith, Larimer County Sheriff, testified in opposition to the bill. He explained that he has taught at CSU, and he stated that he never felt like free expression was limited by the presence of concealed weapons on campus. He discussed disadvantages to limiting weapons held by law-abiding citizens on college campuses, and he noted that colleges can already limit firearms in certain buildings. Senator Harvey and Sheriff Smith discussed the prevalence of gun incidents on campus.

08:12 PM -- Ms. Katherine Whitney, representing herself and Colorado Students for Concealed Carry, testified in opposition to the bill. She explained that she is currently a law student and has a concealed carry permit, and she stated that the bill is about personal safety. She added that the bill does more than keep guns out of the classroom. Senator Harvey and Ms. Whitney discussed her experience carrying a concealed weapon on the CU campus.











08:19 PM -- Ms. Kimberly Weeks, representing herself and her family, testified in opposition to the bill. She described her experience being raped while living near the University of Northern Colorado campus. She explained that many women who survive sexual assault are too ashamed to speak about their experience, and she noted that she now carries a concealed weapon. Ms. Weeks described the added security she feels from being able to carry this weapon.


08:27 PM

Senator Harvey discussed this testimony with Ms. Weeks.

08:33 PM -- Ms. Carol Perry, representing herself and her family, testified in opposition to the bill. She told the committee about rapes on college campuses, including the experience of one of her family members, and she noted that on these campuses, concealed carry was not allowed. She noted that violent criminals will always find a way to obtain guns.


08:44 PM

Senator Harvey responded to Ms. Perry's testimony.

08:48 PM -- Mr. John Minor, Summit County Sheriff, testified in opposition to the bill. He provided statistics regarding rape on college campuses and discussed this information.

08:52 PM -- Mr. Daniel Carey, representing the National Rifle Association, noted his organization's opposition to the bill.

08:52 PM -- Ms. Heather Lockhart, representing herself, testified in opposition to the bill. She explained that she is a student at CU and discussed her experience with sexual assault. She described the value of being able to carry a concealed weapon.

09:01 PM -- Mr. Doug Hamilton, owner of the Cherry Creek Family Shooting Center, testified in opposition to the bill. He discussed the damage the bill could cause and provided examples of the value of concealed carry. He stated that the bill will not stop dangerous killers, and allowing concealed carry is an appropriate response to this threat.


09:12 PM

Senator Harvey commented on the bill and the hearing. Individuals present and opposing the bill stood to be recognized. Committee members received handouts from those who were unable to testify (Attachment I).

13SenState0304AttachI.pdf13SenState0304AttachI.pdf










09:14 PM

Committee members expressed their positions on the bill.


09:17 PM

Senator Heath summarized his reasons for carrying the bill and discussed the testimony. He discussed statistics regarding the use of concealed weapons and expressed his belief that society is safer without concealed weapons on college campuses.
BILL:HB13-1226
TIME: 09:22:24 PM
MOVED:Jones
MOTION:Refer House Bill 13-1226 to the Committee of the Whole. The motion passed on a vote of 3-2.
SECONDED:
VOTE
Crowder
No
Harvey
No
Hudak
Yes
Jones
Yes
Giron
Yes
Final YES: 3 NO: 2 EXC: 0 ABS: 0 FINAL ACTION: PASS


09:30 PM

The committee adjourned.